Effects of Raising Stats

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Joker
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Effects of Raising Stats

Post by Joker »

Seems like a lot of people have the question "What exactly does Charm effect, other than buying/selling prices and Bard spellcasting?" I decided to decompile the mud dats and extract the effects that each ability has on specific skills. Here they are, hot off the press! This list represents the increases to each skill (spellcasting, stealth, etc) based on adding 10 points to the ability (strength, agility, etc.)
  • Ability: For every 10 pts added:

    Strength: 480 Encumberance, +1 Damage

    Agility: +2.5 A/C*, +1 Accuracy, +2.5 Stealth

    Intellect: +1 Critical Hit, +6 Perception, +1 Stealth, +1.5 Thievery, +2 Traps, +3 Picklocks, +2 Tracking, +2 M/R, +5 S/C (Mage), +3.5 S/C (Druid), +1.6 S/C (Priest)

    Willpower: +2 Perception, +1 Tracking, +7 M/R, +2 S/C (Mage), +3.5 S/C (Druid), +5 S/C (Priest),
    +2 S/C (Bard)

    Health: +4 Hit Points

    Charm: +1 Perception, +2.5 Stealth, +1.5 Thievery, +3 Traps, +1 Tracking, +5 S/C (Bard),
    +1 Critical Hit, +1.2 Accuracy, +1 Dodge
* I haven't actually seen my armor class go up 2.5 pts for each 10 pts that I add to agility, so I have to assume it's the same concept as Protection from Evil spells. PREV adds +10 armor against evil creatures, but you don't actually see the increase on your stats, it's just taken into consideration as part of the game mechanics.

Hopefully, this will be useful to you as you build your character through the levels. Cheers!!


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BearFather
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Re: Effects of Raising Stats

Post by BearFather »

Great info, added it to my must see list.


RonPenton
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Re: Effects of Raising Stats

Post by RonPenton »

This is very helpful! How did you do it, disassembler? I tried using IDA Pro and just ended up with megabytes of assembly nonsense, I didn't have the patience to try to remember my x86 assembly and sort through that spaghetti.

I tried plotting all of the effects myself using my own BBS, and got as far as Perception before giving up. Though, my perception formula ended up being:

Intellect * (9 / 14) +
Willpower * (1/ 4) +
Charm * (1 / 8)

You ended up with 6/10, 2/10, and 1/10. So the numbers are close, I suppose.

Also, can you do this for level as well? I noticed that certain stats like Thievery/Traps/MA go up at certain levels.


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Joker
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Re: Effects of Raising Stats

Post by Joker »

RonPenton wrote: Intellect * (9 / 14) +
Willpower * (1/ 4) +
Charm * (1 / 8)

You ended up with 6/10, 2/10, and 1/10. So the numbers are close, I suppose.
Each factor ended with an infinite decimal, so i basically rounded up or down, and gave it a .5 rating if it was within the .4-.6 range. Your numbers here represent the same basic ranges as seen in the decompiler.
RonPenton wrote: Also, can you do this for level as well? I noticed that certain stats like Thievery/Traps/MA go up at certain levels.
WCC actually put a lot of thought into stat increases through level advance. It actually uses very complicated formulas based on your race/class as well. For example, a Dark-elf Ranger will see a perception increase of .01387 points per every point of Intellect, when training to a new level. Meanwhile, an Elf Ranger will see an increase of .01294 points per point of intellect. Likewise, a Dark-elf Warrior sees an increase of .01090 per point of Intellect.

So, you have 3 characters, all training to level 20, all with an 80 Intellect. Here's how it breaks down:

Level 20 D-Elf Ranger, 80 Intellect: 1.1096 increase to awareness
Level 20 Elf Ranger, 80 Intellect: 1.0352 increase to awareness
Level 20 D-Elf Warrior, 80 Intellect: 0.872 increase to awareness

Additionally, you would receive an increase to awareness based on your Willpower and Charm scores as well, plus any additional stat increases you conduct after training. As you can see, you would need to break this down for each class/race combination, and each step increase to Intellect, Willpower and Charm. It would be a very lengthy and time consuming process. General rule of thumb, though, is stealthy magic-using classes will see greater increases to skills than non-stealthy, non-magic classes when training to a new level.

Note, there are also "built-in" bonuses to skills/hit points when certain stats reach pre-designated numbers. Example, you receive big hit point bonuses when your health reaches 60/75/90. Likewise, when your other stats reach the 60/75/90 level, you will see big increases in the respective skills which are affected by that stat.

This would be a good project, and would make an excellent tool to spreadsheet all of this info and post it, but I don't have the time to do so right now. Maybe soon! :)


RonPenton
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Re: Effects of Raising Stats

Post by RonPenton »

That's alright, you've been more than helpful already. I've recorded your findings in the source code to my Web-Based MajorMUD rewrite here: https://github.com/RonPenton/KatanaMUD/ ... r.Stats.cs


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MiOw
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Re: Effects of Raising Stats

Post by MiOw »

Love this post... to add another dimension, is there a substantial impact to consider in the cumulatively effect over levels by raising different stats early? For example, will someone who taps health to 90 at level one see a greater HP gain per level/overall than someone who raises it later or over a greater span? Another way to ask this is whether anything is lost by raising a stat after a retrain at higher levels. The final consideration, is combat or skill effectiveness compromised by not having other stats (agil, int, cha...) raised in lieu of raising health more quickly? The post above would seem to imply that there is if I am reading it right but I'm interested in the perspective on this, especially from the programming crowd!


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BearFather
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Re: Effects of Raising Stats

Post by BearFather »

This is a good question I have pondered my self. I do know your class is what determines your HP roll, but stats just have bonuses. So if you retrain I believe you have a base hp from the rolls, then it adds the bonus from the stats. Now one again this is not tested just putting what I have learn into lines and taking a stupid guess, and I'm too lazy to test this out right now.


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Joker
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Re: Effects of Raising Stats

Post by Joker »

For example, will someone who taps health to 90 at level one see a greater HP gain per level/overall than someone who raises it later or over a greater span?
Test Subjects: 5 Half-Ogre Warriors using Health as the tested ability through level 20-

Hog #1: Every available CP put into health (Health @level 20 = 137)
Hog #2: 75% of available CPs put into health (Health @level 20 = 115)
Hog #3: 50% of available CPs put into health (Health @level 20 =105)
Hog #4: 0% of available CPs put into health (Health @level 20 = 60)
Hog #5: 100% of available CPs stockpiled and added to health at level 20 (Health @level 20 = 137)

So then, at level 20, they had the following HPs:

Hog #1: 259
Hog #2: 237
Hog #3: 199
Hog #4: 178
Hog #5: 263

The two for comparison here are #1 and #5, with number 1 being increased each level, and #5 being increased 1 time at level 20. Both had the same Health at level 20, and the difference between the number of hit points could be attributed to the randomness of the raise per level. I don't think, based on this, there would be any benefit or detriment to raising stats all at once or a little at a time. In the end, you should have roughly the same bonus applied per stat. Also, this was just tested on health, but I would imagine the other stat bonuses would be the same.
The final consideration, is combat or skill effectiveness compromised by not having other stats (agil, int, cha...) raised in lieu of raising health more quickly?
This would definitely be the case. If you have a warrior class and pour every CP into health, his combat is going to suffer until you begin to raise the stats that directly affect combat. With a low strength, the encumberance is going to increase. High encumberance = fewer swings and less accuracy. Also, low strength = less damage per hit.


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BearFather
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Re: Effects of Raising Stats

Post by BearFather »

Ok here's the next question....
If you retrain does the hp rolls change? Would 60 as the base stay the same, or does it save your rolls, and it just adds the hp bonus at the end, or does it add it to each roll.

Make sense?


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Joker
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Re: Effects of Raising Stats

Post by Joker »

If you retrain stats (as i just did on all 5 test subjects from above), the HP's are different now. I'm guessing the bonus applied to your HP's when you add CP's to health is also a randomly generated number that is re-generated with each retrain. My 5 HOG's are now as follows:

Hog #1: 272 (from 259)
Hog #2: 218 (from 237)
Hog #3: 211 (from 199)
Hog #4: 177 (from 178)
Hog #5: 271 (from 263)

As you can see, some characters benefitted from the retrain, while others suffered. It should be added, for clarification, that all stats were retrained to the same numbers they had prior to the retrain. Also, you can see from #4, who maintained the base 60 health, he lost 1 HP during the retrain, which tells me that each level gain is again randomly generated during a retrain to determine the new base HP's prior to adding any CP's.


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